Sub frame removal
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I broke it quickly...And repeatedly...Chaste White Rebuild- Latest: RandomVillager
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I guess technically you could support the engine from above with a hoist and drop the front subframe. For the rear it'd be easier to remove the diff etc rather than supporting it in place as you'll need to pull the drive shafts etc any way to drop the subframe.
Check with your powdercoater, some powdercoat is porous and while it looks nice, isn't usually the best option for items like subframes.
Check with your powdercoater, some powdercoat is porous and while it looks nice, isn't usually the best option for items like subframes.
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- Jan 23, 2018
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Thanks for advice, coating should be ok, they do wheels, bike frames and water tanks. So the subframes and ppf will be rust treated and then coated. Going to get all the wheels, suspension arms and other ali parts done while im at it. Should tidy the underside up nicely.
Was hoping to find a nice balance point for a transmission jack. But may be easier just to put a tower brace on.
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No.
All the rear is quite simple and IMO hard to get wrong, just the diff is heavy so might need two people, easiest way would be to leave running gear on and unbolt the sub frame and lift the car up. not sure if you'd manage it with just a jack though.
I suppose I have a skewed perspective as I've only ever done it with a two poster though ... lol
Front, you'd have to take the engine out
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its not that difficult mate, taking the engine out isn't too bad, but I wouldn't do it just to paint the sub frame
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Had a lie down under the car, i cant really see any reason to remove the sub frame other than cosmetic. The whole underside is good, like really good just a few 10p sized areas need sorting out where the underseal is damaged.
I do however have 1 steel and 1 ally engine mountung bracket ( and 1 was not attached to the subframe????!!)
Going to have a look at rear later in week.
I do however have 1 steel and 1 ally engine mountung bracket ( and 1 was not attached to the subframe????!!)
Going to have a look at rear later in week.
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Didn't know that, would have gone for ally. Should be ok, as it wasnt bolted to the subframe.The ally mounts are known to fail. Get it swapped out for a steel mount.
nukinukinuki
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- Jan 12, 2018
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i have just done the rear and know exactly what is involved, to save yourself a massive amount of time you need to try drop the whole complete rear end off by lifting the car up with a ramp with the wheels still bolted on, hubs, arms, diff , brakes, drive shafts all the lot complete, this way you are not going to create yourself a tonne of work.
If you already have for example a subframe ready to swap out like i had this is the fastest way possible to do it and you don't even have to remove the wheels;
Things to consider if they are still 20 year old and not already done -
-Mark the floor with chalk where the wheels are positioned before you lift the car up off the ground on the ramp (this gives you a good idea where they need to be lined back up when re-fitting , i found this very useful for getting pretty much back inline with the chassis locator pegs for the sub frame
-Remove all Trays, Support bars / Braces and Brackets from the rear underside.
-Remove the exhaust
-Remove the PPF
-disconnect the Prop shaft from the diff, if you remove the prop shaft totally to get it out of the way then bear in mind you will lose gearbox oil if you don't have a -bung to bung the box up.
-disconnect the ABS sensors from under the rear seats and push them down and out under the car.
-disconnect the Handbrake Cables from the calipers and the cable bracket on top of the diff.
-disconnect and remove the drop links to disconnect the suspension leg from the hub
-disconnect the Chassis brake pipe hardline where it connects to the Brake Bias that is bolted to the subframe (bung this pipe up that is fixed to the chassis to save fluid leaking everywhere)
-disconnect the Flexi caliper Brake hoses where they meet the hardline that is clipped into the subframe (the hardline stays on the subframe and the flexi's stay connected to the calipers)
-Disconnect the brake bias already connected to the hardline from the old subframe
-Disconnect the Upper A arms from the Subframe, Disconnect the Toe Links from the subframe, Disconnect the Trailing Arm from the Subframe and then get a Pry bar and carefully disconnect the drive shaft out of the diff, you can then pull the whole wheel assembly with the drive shaft , Hub , Arms and Links all still connected in one lump- Repeat this to both sides leaving an empty subframe with the diff and hanger still connected.
- You can now remove the diff hanger from the Subframe with the Diff still connected to it (i personally removed the diff from the hanger Separately as i changed out my Diff Bushes at the same time.
Now onto the re-fitment of the New subframe -
install the brake Bias that is connected to the hardline to the new subframe (there is just is 3 clips to transfer over and you can actually get to the back of them with your fingers so you don't damage them prising them out with a screwdriver)
If you already have for example a subframe ready to swap out like i had this is the fastest way possible to do it and you don't even have to remove the wheels;
Things to consider if they are still 20 year old and not already done -
- underseal the area while the sub frame is out.
- Re-locate / Change the fuel filter if you still have it in the awful stock location
- Gearbox Output seal
- Diff seals for drive shafts (in case they split/bust or rip the dust seal springs out when disturbing the shafts)
- Diff hanger Bushes
- wire brushing accessable threads and using some penetrating oil on the caster bolts a week or so before the job
-Mark the floor with chalk where the wheels are positioned before you lift the car up off the ground on the ramp (this gives you a good idea where they need to be lined back up when re-fitting , i found this very useful for getting pretty much back inline with the chassis locator pegs for the sub frame
-Remove all Trays, Support bars / Braces and Brackets from the rear underside.
-Remove the exhaust
-Remove the PPF
-disconnect the Prop shaft from the diff, if you remove the prop shaft totally to get it out of the way then bear in mind you will lose gearbox oil if you don't have a -bung to bung the box up.
-disconnect the ABS sensors from under the rear seats and push them down and out under the car.
-disconnect the Handbrake Cables from the calipers and the cable bracket on top of the diff.
-disconnect and remove the drop links to disconnect the suspension leg from the hub
-disconnect the Chassis brake pipe hardline where it connects to the Brake Bias that is bolted to the subframe (bung this pipe up that is fixed to the chassis to save fluid leaking everywhere)
-disconnect the Flexi caliper Brake hoses where they meet the hardline that is clipped into the subframe (the hardline stays on the subframe and the flexi's stay connected to the calipers)
- you are now ready to remove the whole thing, loosen all of the subframe bolts and then lower the car so the diff is sat firmly on a jack and jack the diff so the subframe is tightly pressed up against the chasiss, you can then start to remove all the bolts.
- now slowly lower the jack and the subframe will come away from the body, once you are happy its all clear you can lift the whole car up on the ramp leaving the whole back end of the floor.
-Disconnect the brake bias already connected to the hardline from the old subframe
-Disconnect the Upper A arms from the Subframe, Disconnect the Toe Links from the subframe, Disconnect the Trailing Arm from the Subframe and then get a Pry bar and carefully disconnect the drive shaft out of the diff, you can then pull the whole wheel assembly with the drive shaft , Hub , Arms and Links all still connected in one lump- Repeat this to both sides leaving an empty subframe with the diff and hanger still connected.
- You can now remove the diff hanger from the Subframe with the Diff still connected to it (i personally removed the diff from the hanger Separately as i changed out my Diff Bushes at the same time.
Now onto the re-fitment of the New subframe -
install the brake Bias that is connected to the hardline to the new subframe (there is just is 3 clips to transfer over and you can actually get to the back of them with your fingers so you don't damage them prising them out with a screwdriver)
- Now get your same block of wood and support the diff under the new subframe and then Re-install the Diff hanger and diff (if you left the diff still connected to the hanger then you only need to connect the hanger)
- Now Guide your whole complete wheel assembly with hub, drive shaft , arms etc back into the new subframe and loosely connect all the bolts back to the new subframe and then re-connect the shafts into the diff (do this on both sides)
- Now connect back up your flexi brake lines to your subframe hard line
Last edited:
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- Jan 23, 2018
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Thats a great help, armed with this information i think i can drop the frame with out wheels using a transmission jack. Ill have to do a bit of measuring to check if i can get enough clearance just on axle stands
Calum122
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- Feb 24, 2019
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Looks like a daunting task to me.
Can I ask....why this is necessary?
"Mark the floor with chalk where the wheels are positioned before you lift the car up off the ground on the ramp (this gives you a good idea where they need to be lined back up when re-fitting , i found this very useful for getting pretty much back inline with the chassis locator pegs for the sub frame "
Can I ask....why this is necessary?
"Mark the floor with chalk where the wheels are positioned before you lift the car up off the ground on the ramp (this gives you a good idea where they need to be lined back up when re-fitting , i found this very useful for getting pretty much back inline with the chassis locator pegs for the sub frame "
nukinukinuki
Member
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- Jan 12, 2018
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- 65
Its not necessary to do this at all but if your car is on a ramp and its staying in the same possition its worth marking where the wheels were before you drop the rear end, the chassis has locator pegs where the subframe locates which enables the bolt holes to line back up, if you have a full rear complete subframe to refit with the diff, shafts and everything else it weighs a lot so the less you have to mess aroud trying move it around laid on your back trying to balance it on a jack to get it in place if your miles out the better. So if you know exactly where it came off you can pretty much get it lined up first time, but as i said this is not mandatory it is just something i did.
